Author Topic: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?  (Read 4749 times)

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Offline Edwin Croissant

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Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« on: November 30, 2017, 01:00:14 AM »
Out of curiosity I bought a Ford Fiesta/Ka/Puma heater control valve on AliExpress for less then 11 euro including shipping to see if it could be used to control the dephlegmator (reflux condenser).

Normally the heating in a car is done by regulating the airflow through the heating core located in the dashboard. To prevent a hot dashboard in the summer the water flow through the heating core is switch off by means of a vacuum operated valve. Sometimes these valves have four water connections, two connected to the coolant system of the engine and two to the heater core. When the heating is switched off the valve act as a bypass preventing the coolant fluid go through the heater core.

In the Ford Fiesta/Ka/Puma this valve is also used to regulate the amount of heat and is solenoid operated. When de-energised all coolant flows through the heater core, when energized the heater core is bypasses and the heater is leak free blocked by means of a seal. From a YouTube movie I got the impression that the valve is a proportional valve, more current through the solenoid means less water through the heater core, however this is not the case. The valve is pulse width modulated with a very low frequency of about 0.3 Hz. For example one second on and two seconds off give 2/3 of the available heat, two seconds on and one second off gives 1/3 of the available heat.

It might be possible to use this valve to control the cooling capacity of a reflux condenser. I remember that have seen a topic on another forum showing the use of switched solenoid valves to regulate the amount of reflux, so this seems to be possible. A Youtube movie from Swede Olson from  http://distillerycontrols.com shows this system using a frequency of about 0.2 Hz. So this valve might be a cost effective solution.

The advantage of using this valve is the use of one solenoid instead of two and the elimination of water hammer, as the coolant flow is not interrupted during switching.

The disadvantage is the short life expectancy according to the amount of Youtube movies that describe how to change this valve. What happens is that the seal diaphragm start leaking causing coolant leakage and/or the valve to seize. In a heater control application the solenoid and the seal diaphragm is always hot, in a cooling application always cold. Maybe this will prolong the life of this valve.

On disassemble I found that one screw was different then the other three, no idea if this is on purpose.

Some details:

Coil resistance  ~12 ohm
Coil inductance  ~54 mH
Capacitor is 56 pF 3kV

Connecting tube od 16.1 mm with a barb of 18.2 mm
Valve id 11.5 mm
Valve travel about 4 to 5 mm

Manual control could be done with a 555 timer circuit and with an Arduino the sky is probably the limit.

What do you think?

Offline ketel3

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2017, 01:13:33 AM »
A great idea Edwin.

I think you have a lot of thinking to do,but that never was a problem  :) but a great part of the hobby.

Is it a makeable project ,I think yes.

Personaly I'm more interrested to control the output of my lm system,never the less I will folow this project with interrest.

Better bad weather than no weather

Offline ShiFu

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2017, 06:06:16 PM »
I want to follow this too!

I think if you can control that valve to within a few seconds you should be golden.
The temperature changes in a still column are slow and gradual.
But those are large steps to make, Off or 33% or 66% or 100% On.
There will be quite the in-rush of cooling water between steps.

That's still a magnitude better than a simple On-Off solenoid valve that slams full On and then slams full Off.

A water pressure regulator added between the mains and the valve should help to soften the inrush?
Stay calm and follow the screaming people.

Offline Edwin Croissant

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2017, 01:17:22 AM »
It's just a on/off system, but the valve is designed to be in series in a cooling system, so there is no water hammer when the valve switches.

 This is shows how the valve is switched:

And this Swede Olson's movie:

Offline ketel3

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2017, 02:56:21 AM »
VERY nice but he has no EPARROT  :)
Better bad weather than no weather

Offline Edwin Croissant

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 01:06:29 AM »
I found a led dimmer that I bought a year ago but was misplaced in the commotion about a year ago. The dimmer is a 8A 12-24V led dimmer and it has a NE555 on 5V running at about 1 kHz followed by a op-amp to get a adjustable duty cycle. The 100nF capacitor is charged through a 10k resistor and discharged through a 1k resistor. I came across several versions but the general idea is the same.

I modified this dimmer with a 1N4007 diode across the output as protection for the solenoid and soldered a 470uF capacitor in parallel with the 100nF capacitor to get a frequency of about 0.25 Hz. Now I can control the duty cycle to the heater control valve to test the valve with water flow :)
8A12VLedDimmerMod1.jpgFord Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
* 8A12VLedDimmerMod1.jpg (156.86 kB. 350x466 - viewed 2103 times.)8A12VLedDimmerMod2.jpgFord Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
* 8A12VLedDimmerMod2.jpg (188.88 kB. 350x466 - viewed 1684 times.)8A12VLedDimmerMod3.jpgFord Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
* 8A12VLedDimmerMod3.jpg (191.93 kB. 350x262 - viewed 1549 times.)

 

Offline ketel3

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Re: Ford Ka heater control valve for dephlegmator control?
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2017, 01:11:59 AM »
Edwin ,Im not a completaly  greenhorn in eletronics but this is high school ,man I have no idea what you are talking about,but this will be  a great project again  :)
Tomorrow my first test with the eparrot on the large kettle,with full advantage of all the parameters?
The test with the small kettle was only limited to temp reading now the eparrot got on the painbank,keep you updated  ;)
Better bad weather than no weather